Jack: The countdown is on for this pride weekend and at the annual NYC pride March the event is a highlight of the New York City calendar, a celebration of diversity of the LGBTQ+ community and also of New York's activists central role in the movement for equal rights.

That aspect has prediction -- given the increasing violence against LGBTQ+ people in the record numbers of bills in statehouses targeting their rights, especially those of transgender youth.

To drive home that point, the theme of this year's pride is strength in solidarity.

Organizers have chosen five grand marshals.

Among them is Randy Ricker, a Trail Blazer in the movement dating back to the 1960's.

1962, he organized the first radio broadcast where homosexuals spoke for themselves.

1964, he led the first public protest against anti-gay discrimination.

1966, he participated in a demonstration to bring greater awareness to New York laws preventing bartenders from serving LGBTQ+ people.

That was just the beginning of a career in active synthetic and news strong to this day.

Joining us now to talk about that career and the current climate on the upcoming parade's activists, author and archivist Randy Ricker.

Thank you for joining us.

>> It is a pleasure to be here.

Correction.

Jack: Go ahead.

>> I started in 1958.

I've been in the movement for four years by the time they broke into radio and television.

Jack: Perfect, my first question was going to be, looking back at all of those years, what was it that caused you to say this is something that you felt you needed to get actively involved with all the way back in the 1950's?

>> When I came out, we were criminals in every state.

Whenever you saw any representation of gay people on TV or radio, except maybe -- fighters.

-- killed a kid for fun.

Psychiatric professionals said we were sick.

We were sinners by almost every standard, except the Quakers.

It was ridiculous because when I finally found gay life, I -- here are all of these boys going to Brown, just graduated from Columbia, young people, average looking like me.

We weren't screaming queens, we weren't running around in drag.

I turned on the TV and you would hear people on the radio, to the extent they talked about the "sickness" of homosexuality, it was all about the business of mental illness.

So they would be there talking about, well, we can save your kid.

If he is gay, if he is a homosexual, we can straighten him out and get him on the right path in just six sessions.

Of course if it didn't work, they just said you needed six more sessions.

There was no discussion about whether or not they were curable or not.

1962, I was so annoyed, they had a panel on WBA I I can a supposedly liberal station in New York and I said wait a minute, we homosexuals, we are the authorities on homosexuality.

You are facilitating fraud.

Working on these psychiatrists who claim they can change a homosexual.

They were open to the idea.

Jack: Let me ask you about that.

It is a dramatically different time.

I am sure there are people who are part of the movement now who might not even know about the fact that social activity amongst gay people was criminalized in so many states.

You go to the radio people and to say, give us a chance to talk.

To explain things.

What was their reaction?

Did you get pushback?

>> No.

They listen to because they had never seen anybody in a coat and tie saying, we are authorities on our own things.

WBAI said, get me a panel together and we will do an interview.

I got a panel of my friends, an interracial couple, a bisexual, my Puerto Rico friend didn't show up, but we had an hour and a half discussion that it was announced that WBAI would have programs they were doing and a week or two before the program itself,?

Brian.

-- Jack O'Brien came up with this article that said that these Pur's were on the air, these sick and sad people.

Something panel where they would discuss homosexuals.

The venom that dripped from that article.

I took it as the greatest PR piece I was ever handed.

This attack on me from the New York Times, a suit and tie homosexual, a little old man would say, does this card mean what it says?

I said, what else would it mean?

So and so, homosexual is here.

Jack: That was your calling card.

>> That was my calling card.

Jack: A respectable individual.

>> -- to short list to show to the reporter that I really am somebody.

I am speaking as a homosexual with other homosexuals, which had never been done before.

Jack: What was the public reaction?

>> It was the most famous show.

It became the most watched show.

A rave review by Jack Gould comminuted columnists in the New York Times.

A full page in Newsweek called "minority listening."

Religious conservatives were watching.

They were running things in Florida, they went to the Federal Communications Commission and said, you should revoke the license of WBAI.

They are putting perverts on the air.

The Federal Communications Commission issued a ruling where they decided to cancel -- decided not to cancel WBAI's license saying homosexuality was a legitimate subject for discussion on the airwaves.

That opened the door to radio and television and suddenly all of the TV and radio stations that were afraid to even touch the subject were calling that a shame.

Jack: You broke down the door and a lot of ways.

Coming up and getting in on the air.

Me ask you another thing, this may be something that people just don't understand what's taking place at the time.

I mentioned your being part of the protest at a bar that focused on rules that prevented bartenders from serving gay people.

Explain that to us.

>> I was a member of the -- Society of New York, which was a conservative gay group started by Harry hey in Los Angeles.

There's a whole 20 year history before Stonewall.

In those days, it was -- regulations to allow homosexuals to allow homosexuals together on your premises or to be served drinks.

That meant that every bar, every gay bar was run by the mob, they had to pay off the police to operate.

If I went there with -- or anything that would say, you can't get that in here.

Until they try to throw me out, nobody was interested in the literature because for some reason people had the idea that we don't want people to know we homosexuals are just like normal people.

As long as I think we all wear mascara and have high-pitched voices and run around looking obvious, we are say.

Because we look normal.

I was the only personal that person to -- the other was a member of -- there were other people that were intelligent, articulate, probably better informed than me many ways, but they had jobs.

In those days, there were no -- at all.

You could be subject to being fired by your boss or corporation.

You could be evicted from your apartment.

It wasn't a hate crime, it was just a decent citizen beating up a filthy, dirty pervert.

That was the mentality in the 1950's.

And then we changed.

Once we got on the air, the question went from being, what can we do to cure the sickness of homosexuality?

We started bringing up studies that showed we were not mentally ill. And then the question was coming more and more, are they sick or aren't they sick?

The theological circles had started asking the question, are they sinners or not?

That started to open the door.

But, it took 65 years from when I joined.

I am a 65 year veteran.

I began at the age of 20 and I am now 85.

Jack: Looking at what has taken place between the 1950's, when you first got involved, and today.

This is the last question, we have got admitted and a half.

-- What you have lived through.

A lot of people have to look back, but you lived through it.

As you sit here today, do you remain fearful about the human rights progress we have made?

Or, are you optimistic?

Or, somewhere in between?

>> I am optimistic.

There is always backlash.

After backlash, it ends up with more education.

Just like in recovery, we have much more to do.

The real key, I didn't have an answer when they asked me this at another station about trans people.

Go on the Internet.

On the Internet, people -- trans people are able to meet one another and educate each other.

You can find more about trans people by watching their videos on YouTube.

That is how trans people discover themselves.

That includes gay people as well in her and countries.

They don't even dreamed that there is a place to see videos on YouTube about Gay pride events or gay people talking about their lives, and it gives them hope.

That is the way to go forward, keep hope alive.

As long as you have uncensored communication and a way to spread the message of hope, love is more powerful than hate.

Love will ultimately triumph.

Jack: Randy Wicker, the perfect way to wrap up this conversation is distress this notion of hope, as you have done.

We talked about the fact that you have lived this history and you are a wonderful repository of memories and important moments and what needs to be done in the future.

Thank you for spending time with us.

Take care of yourself.

We look forward to talking again sometime soon.

>> Thank you so much.

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