>> ERIC: THURSDAY, THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION SUED MINNESOTA SECRETARY OF STATE STEVE SIMON FOR NOT TURNING OVER VOTER REGISTRATION INFORMATION.

THE POSSIBILITY OF A FEDERAL GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN LOOMS EVER CLOSER.

AND THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION HAS DIRECTED FEDERAL AGENCIES TO CONSIDER MASS LAYOFFS IN THE EVENT OF A SHUTDOWN.

THAT GIVES US PLENTY TO COVER WITH THIS WEEK'S COUCH FULL OF POLITICAL SCIENCE PROFESSORS.

MICHAEL MINTA JOINS US FROM THE UNIVERSITY OF MINNESOTA'S HUBERT H. HUMPHREY SCHOOL OF PUBLIC AFFAIRS, ALONG WITH LARRY JACOBS, WHO HEADS UP THE U'S CENTER FOR POLITICS AND GOVERNANCE.

AND DAVID SCHULTZ IS BACK FROM HAMLINE UNIVERSITY, WHERE HE TEACHES POLITICAL SCIENCE.

HE ALSO SPENDS SOME TIME TEACHING LAW AT THE UNIVERSITY OF ST.

THOMAS.

PROFESSOR MINTA, THE OLD FIRE HOSE IS GOING HERE.

WHO KNOWS WHO KNO KNOWS WHERE TO START.

BUT THE REPUBLICANS IN THE SENATE NEED SEVEN DEMOCRATIC VOTES TO PREVENT A SCHOENBERG.

ARE THEY GOING TO GET 'EM?

>> OH, WOW, THE CONSTITUENTS OBVIOUSLY WANT THE DEMOCRATS TO PLAY HARD BALL.

THEY THINK THEY'RE BEING RUN OVER BY THE REPUBLICANS.

I MEAN, I THINK YES, THEY WILL GET IT.

BECAUSE THE GOVERNMENT CAN'T STAY SHUT DOWN FOREVER.

BUT I THINK THERE IS GOING TO BE SOME TYPE OF FIGHT OR SOME PUSHBACK, JUST TO SHOW THEY'RE FIGHTING BACK.

BUT EVENTUALLY, I MEAN, WE NEED GOVERNMENT.

YOU NEED TO FUND IT.

AND IT HURTS BOTH CONSTITUENCIES, DEMOCRATS AND REPUBLICANS.

>> Eric: WHAT'S THE POLITICAL CALCULATION HERE?

FOR BOTH SIDES?

WHAT ARE THEY THINKING?

>> I THINK THE DEMOCRATS IS AS PROFESSOR MINTA JUST SAID, ARE REALLY UNDER HEAT.

THE BASE OF THE PARTY IS FURIOUS AT WHAT THEY SAY AS A CAPITULATION DURING THE SPRING.

BUT THEY ALSO SEE A REAL PLAY HERE, WHICH IS THEY'RE TELLING THE REPUBLICANS, WE WILL ONLY VOTE FOR THIS IF YOU EXTEND THE SUBSIDIES FOR THE HEALTH INSURANCE THROUGH THE AFFORDABLE CARE ACT.

NOW, IF THE REPUBLICANS DON'T DO THAT, PROBABLY 24 MILLION PEOPLE ARE GOING TO LOSE THOSE SUBSIDIES AND THOSE PEOPLE ARE GOING TO, ON AVERAGE, SEE THEIR PREMIUMS GO UP 75%.

SO DEMOCRATS THINK, LET'S FIGHT OVER THAT.

AND SO THEY'RE GOING TO TRY TO CHANGE THE QUESTION AND WHAT THIS IS ABOUT.

REPUBLICAN SIDE, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE TALKING A BIG GAME HERE.

THEY'RE SAYING, HEY, WE'RE GOING TO DO MASS FIRINGS.

AND DEMOCRATS ARE LIKE, IF THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO DO, WE'RE GOING TO RUN ADS ON THAT.

WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT THEY DID IN VIRGINIA.

TALKING ABOUT REPUBLICANS RUINING THE LIVES OF VOTERS.

>> Eric: WHAT DO YOU THINK?

>> IT'S A LOT OF GAME OF POLITICAL CHICKEN GOING ON AT THIS POINT.

THAT BOTH SIDES ARE PLAYING TO THEIR BASES.

BOTH SIDES, I STILL SAY, ARE IN A NEGOTIATING POSITION AT THIS POINT.

AND I SPUBT THERE'S GOING TO BE AT LEAST A TEMPORARY SCHOENBERG.

I MEAN, HOW LONG IT'S GOING TO BE, I DON'T KNOW.

BUT THINK ABOUT IT.

SCHUMER IS UNDER ENORMOUS PRESSURE AT THIS POINT FOR WHAT LOOKED LIKE A CAPITULATION LAST TIME.

SO HE HAS TO TAKE A LINE IN THE SAND AT THIS POINT.

SO AGAIN, I THINK THERE'S GOING TO BE SOME SIGNED OF A SCHOENBERG, BUT EVENTUALLY, THEY'RE GOING TO REACH AGREEMENT.

BUT HOW LONG, I DON'T KNOW.

>> Cathy: SO THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE HAS SUED EIGHT STATES INCLUDING MINNESOTA TO COMPEL THEM TO SHARE VOTER REGISTRATION LISTS.

BUT I'M WONDERING, WHY IS THAT DATA NEEDED?

DOESN'T THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT ALREADY KIND OF HAVE A LOT OF THAT DATA?

>> THEY HAVE A LOT OF THAT DATA AT THIS POINT.

BUT I THINK WHAT WE'RE SEEING HERE, AGAIN, IS ANOTHER EFFORT BY THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION TARGETING STATES LIKE MINNESOTA, YOU KNOW, WHICH ARE FAIRLY LOYAL DEMOCRATIC STATES, AND TRYING TO CREATE LOTS OF PROBLEMS, YOU KNOW, FOR THE WALZ ADMINISTRATION OR THE STATE OF MINNESOTA.

SO I THINK THAT'S PART OF IT HERE.

BUT I THINK THERE'S EVEN A BROADER CONCERN HERE WHICH IS REALLY ABOUT THE CONCERN ABOUT FEDERALISM HERE AT SOME POINT.

AND THE ISSUE ABOUT FEDERALISM SUPPOSED TO BE THAT PRIMARILY ELECTIONS ARE RUN BY THE STATES.

AND THEY GET TO DO WHAT THEY WANT HERE.

AND I THINK THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION IS TRYING TO MAKE SOME PRETTY STRONG MOVES HERE TO SAY, YOU KNOW, WE WANT TO KNOW MORE ABOUT WHAT YOU'RE DOING, WE WANT TO CONTROL THE ELECTIONS.

WE BASICALLY WANT TO -- >> BUT, DAVID, THEY ALSO REALIZE THAT THEY HAVE AREAS THAT REPUBLICANS CONTROL THE ELECTION MACHINERY TOO.

SO I THINK IN A LOT OF WAYS AND YOU SEE IT CONSISTENT WITH THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, S TO MAKE GOVERNMENT AGENCY EXPEND RESOURCES OR PRIVATE GROUPS TO SPEND RESOURCES IN ORDER TO FIGHT OFF THESE -- THEY KNOW THAT THE LIKELIHOOD OF THIS HAPPENING IS VERY LOW, BUT IF YOU SPEND A LOT OF RESOURCES TRYING TO FIGHT, GIVING THE VOTER ROLLS AND ALL OF THAT, YOU KNOW, THE FEDERALISM QUESTION, THAT IT'LL JUST TIE EVERYTHING UP, AND THEN -- AND HAT SEEMS TO BE A LOT OF WHAT'S HAPPENING HERE.

>> I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT COMEY BEING INDICTED ALSO TOO.

BUT SORT OF THE SAME THING.

THE ODDS OF HIM BEING ACTUALLY CONVICTED WITH PRACTICALLY NIL.

FORCE PEOPLE TO SPEND RESOURCES AND REALLY PUT DEMOCRATS OR WHOEVER IT IS ON THE BACK FOOT.

>> Eric: HOW ABOUT THE TURNING POINT EVENT AT NORTHROP WITH A FEW DOZEN PROTESTORS.

OF COURSE CHARLIE KIRK'S MURDER HAS GALVANIZED THAT GROUP AND WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF THAT WHOLE SITUATION?

>> WELL, OBVIOUSLY CHARLIE KIRK'S MURDER IS HORRIFIC.

AND, YOU KNOW, THE DIRECTION THE COUNTRY'S GOING, IF IT'S TOWARDS VIOLENCE, IT'S JUST LIKE NO RETURN FROM THAT.

SO I THINK THAT'S POINT ONE.

POINT TWO, I WAS ACTUALLY PLEASED BY THE FACT THAT THE UNIVERSITY TEPPED UP, THAT THERE WAS AN EVENT THAT WENT FORWARD.

YOU KNOW, THE ENERGY THAT WAS IN THE AUDITORIUM FROM CONSERVATIVE STUDENTS, WONDERFUL.

YEAH, THERE WERE PROTESTERS THERE.

I THINK THEY'RE EXERCISING THEIR FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHTS, THEIR FREE SPEECH.

AND THEY DIDN'T PREVENT THE EVENT FROM OING FORWARD.

THAT'S THE KEY THING, AND, YOU KNOW, WE NEED TO HAVE EXCHANGES OF IDEAS AND SOMETIMES IDEAS THAT YOU MAY DISAGREE WITH MOST.

>> Cathy: I'M GLAD YOU BROUGHT THIS UP BECAUSE THE TWO MAJOR TV OWNERSHIP GROUPS THAT WERE -- WALKED BACK THEIR DECISION TO CANCEL JIMMY KIMMEL, RIGHT, AND DID THAT SHOW YOU THAT THERE WAS OVERREACH BY THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION AND SUBSTANTIAL PUBLIC BACKLASH?

TO THAT DECISION?

BUT I'M WONDERING, IF THIS IS THE FIRST SALVO IN A FREE SPEECH BATTLE?

>> THAT'S A VERY INTERESTING THING AND YOU SAW THAT AS SENATOR CRUZ CAME OUT AND SAID, LOOK, E CAN'T LET THIS HAPPEN BECAUSE EVENTUALLY, DEMOCRATS WILL BE IN CONTROL AT ONE POINT AND YOU DON'T WANT THEM COMING AFTER CONSERVATIVES.

AND SO I THINK THIS IS -- AGAIN, I JUST -- JUST WATCHING THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION AND REPUBLICANS, I MEAN, IT REALLY IS THIS LIKE, LOOK, WE'RE GOING TO THROW IT AND WE'RE GOING TO SEE IF IT STICKS AND THEY KNOW THAT IT MAY NOT LIKELY STICK.

I THINK THAT IT -- THESE -- THE FCC CHAIRMAN, I MEAN, I THOUGHT WAS VERY, VERY -- AND I THINK -- AND THE THING IS, I THINK THEY KNEW THAT THERE'S NO WAY THAT YOU CAN INTIMIDATE R IN ORDER TO STOP SOMEONE FROM SHOWING PROGRAMMING, BUT THEY DID IT ANYWAY.

THERE AS A BUNCH OF UPROAR.

AND IT'S SHOWING TO OUR BASE, WE'RE REALLY STOPPING THESE LIBERALS AND THEY'RE GOING AROUND AND THEY'RE USING THE PUBLIC AIR IN ORDER TO MAKE POINTS AND WE'RE SHOWING WE'RE GOING TO DO SOMETHING.

AND YOU SEE KIMMEL IS BACK ON THE AIR.

SO THEY'RE SAYING, HEY, WE'RE TAKING A STAND, BUT YOU SAW THEY ALLOWED THAT KIMMEL IS COMING BACK.

>> BUT I COULDN'T DESCRIBE KIMMEL COMING BACK ON THE AIR AS A TRIUMPH FOR FREE SPEECH.

THIS WHOLE EPISODE SHOWS THE INCREDIBLE POWER OF CORPORATE MEDIA OVER ACCESS TO INFORMATION IN THE UNITED STATES.

WE GOT SIX CORPORATIONS IN THIS COUNTRY THAT CONTROL ROUGHLY ABOUT 90% OF THE MEDIA MARKET IN THE UNITED STATES.

TWO BIG STATIONS, YOU KNOW, SIN CLAIRE AND I FORGOT WHAT THE OTHER ONE WAS.

NEXT STAR.

THEY STILL REFUSED.

THIS REALLY SHOWED ME THAT WE'VE GOT REAL SERIOUS PROBLEMS WITH CORPORATE CONTROL OF ACCESS TO INFORMATION IN THIS COUNTRY.

AND THE FACT THAT CORPORATIONS, WHETHER UNDER PRESSURE FROM THE GOVERNMENT OR INDEPENDENT ON THEIR OWN, THEY ARE THE GUARDIANS OF THE INFORMATION THAT WE GET.

AND THAT IS A DANGEROUS AND SCARY PLACE TO BE.

>> Eric: IS IMPEACHMENT A GIVEN IF THE DEMOCRATS TAKE BACK THE HOUSE IN THE 2026 ELECTION?

>> I DON'T THINK SO.

I MEAN, CERTAINLY THERE'S GOING TO BE A, YOU KNOW, SOME INTEREST IN THAT AMONG DEMOCRATIC BASE.

BUT, LOOK, DEMOCRATS WANT TO RUN ON AGENDA.

THAT THEY CAN GO INTO 2028 ABOUT AND THAT AGENDA IS GOING TO BE, LET'S GO BACK TO THE REPUBLICAN BUDGET.

LET'S TALK ABOUT THE CUTS IN HEALTHCARE.

LET'S TALK ABOUT THE CONSEQUENCES FOR THE ENVIRONMENT.

THEY'RE GOING TO WANT TO PUSH THE AGENDA.

WE'RE GOING TO SEE A LOT OF INVESTIGATIONS, IF THE DEMOCRATS GET THE MAJORITY IN THE HOUSE.

AND THERE'S PLENTY TO WORK WITH.

I MEAN, JUST, YOU KNOW, PRACTICALLY EVERY DEPARTMENT HAS GOT SKELETONS.

AND SO THAT'S WHAT IT'S GOING TO BE.

IT'S NOT GOING TO BE PRETTY.

THIS IS NOT GOING TO BE, YOU KNOW, GOVERNANCE IS A CARDING TO THE HUMPHREY SCHOOL PLAYBOOK.

BUT IT'S GOING TO BE REALLY HARDBALL POLITICS.

>> Eric: CHANCES FOR GOVERNOR WALZ TO WIN A THIRD TERM?

SOUNDS HE'S GOING TO RUN ALMOST EXCLUSIVELY AGAINST PRESIDENT TRUMP.

>> AGAINST TRUMP, AGAINST GUNS.

NORMALLY I WOULD SAY THE CHANCES OF A THIRD TERM ARE PRETTY LOW, ESPECIALLY WHERE HIS NUMBERS ARE.

BUT RIGHT NOW THERE'S NOT A STRONG REPUBLICAN FIELD OUT THERE THAT'S REALLY EMERGING AT THIS POINT AND WITH WALZ HAVING THE MONEY HE HAS THE RESOURCES AND THE NAME RECOGNITION, HE'S GOT NOT A BAD CHANCE OF WINNING A THIRD TERM.

>> I GENERALLY AGREE WITH THAT.

I THINK ONE THING JUST TO APPRECIATE IS, OUR ELECTIONS, INCLUDING GUBERNATORIAL ELECTIONS HAVE BEEN NATIONALIZED.

IT MAY SEEM ODD THAT YOU'D HAVE A GOVERNOR RUNNING AGAINST DONALD TRUMP, BUT THAT IS HOW POLITICS HAVE PLAYED OUT.

AND SO YOU'RE SEEING GOVERNOR WALZ CONSTANTLY HARPING ON THE CONSEQUENCES OF TRUMP'S BUDGET CUTS.

BECAUSE HE'S GOING TO WANT TO -- WHOEVER THE REPUBLICAN CANDIDATE IS, MERGE THEM WITH DONALD TRUMP.

>> Cathy: YOU GUYS