On the record is brought to you by Steve and Adele Dufilho San Antonio is a fast growing, fast moving city with something new happening every day.

That's why each week we go on the record with Randy Beamer and the newsmakers who are driving this change.

Then we gather at the reporters roundtable to talk about the latest news stories with the journalist behind those stories.

Join us now as we go on the record with Randy Beamer.

Hi, everybody, and thank you for joining us for On the Record this week on Randy Beamer.

And we are starting with everything about downtown San Antonio to begin with, Centro San Antonio is a group that oversees all kinds of things related to downtown.

President and CEO of Center San Antonio is Tricia Barry.

Thank you very much for coming in.

Of course, always a pleasure to be here.

All kinds of headlines over the past year, some of the top stories in San Antonio were about downtown San Antonio.

First, we'll start with where we are and Project Marble and the missions baseball stadium.

What's the latest that you're hearing on on Project Marble and say the timeline for what's going to happen now?

Right.

Well, let me just say nobody could be more excited, obviously, about marble in a baseball stadium in downtown, because what does it mean?

We're bookending downtown.

The near west end of downtown will have a missions baseball stadium.

And then depending on what happens, we could have the Spurs moving to the Near East in downtown.

So that bookend means what it means demand for services, infill and between bars, restaurants, sports and entertainment district.

I love Project Marble and for a big reason, and that is we are really from a San Antonio perspective.

We have set the standard regarding hospital.

It is the reason why the Final Four has kept coming back to San Antonio right this year again.

So the beautiful thing about it is we are leaning into what we do best, which is hospitality.

So anyway, from a detail perspective, obviously there was a critical vote that was taken in regarding the baseball stadium.

So there will be some other votes that are taken on city Council, regarding details associated with the stadium, but by and large, the stadium is cut.

The mission stadium.

And it's not just the stadium.

That's one of those things where that's all we talk about right there on the news.

But it's a much larger.

Well, the beauty associated with the project is there was also a commitment by Weston Urban that they're going to put like several thousand units, obviously, of housing on the ground in downtown, which we desperately need.

And until such time as they do that, when they do, when they do, it will trigger the construction of, the baseball stadium.

So, you know, I think the city struck actually a pretty good deal, obviously, despite what some people have said, that if they don't fulfill that commitment, the stadium has to start regarding construction.

So that's a that's a net plus obviously.

And then we look at what's happening with Project Marvel.

Look, I'm all about big and bold and audacious.

I mean that's just kind of in my DNA.

So I love the fact that we are thinking big.

However, the devil's in the details.

So what I have heard is that there was a thought that it would go to a referendum project.

Marvel and financing and the equation associated with that would go to a vote in May.

But Judge Sakai said, I pump the brakes a little bit because we need more details associated with that.

So it will go in November, but hopefully that gives people a, runway to be able to learn more about what does the financing strategy look like, and is there going to be, really burden upon the taxpayer regarding.

And that's the key, because when you say things like bars and restaurants, it's going to bring all this in, right?

We were told that as well back when the Frost Bank center, the AT&T center, and that didn't happen.

And also what happens with that?

You have to answer all those questions.

And then you also have to remind people it's not just about the Spurs venue, but the convention center, a hotel, the Alamodome.

How needed necessary is another big hotel downtown.

People might wonder why another big convention center hotel, as well as redoing the Alamodome itself.

Well, I mean, from an outsider perspective, the final Four has made it very clear we love San Antonio, which is why we have come back again and again.

But the competition in other cities regarding major facilities, the Alamodome is not up to par with what we've seen.

So this will be our last year in San Antonio unless you do more regarding the Alamodome.

So we've been put on notice essentially.

So what happens?

And that's a great part of Project Marvel is what happens with the Alamo Dome.

Is it torn down?

Is it rebuilt?

I don't know that you can put enough money into the Alamodome to bring it up to par with what major Pierce cities are doing with their domes and 60,000 seat facilities, right.

So that's one thing.

But then a major, another major convention center hotel, I think is not necessarily a bad thing.

I mean, we have the opportunity to be able to host major conventions.

We've seen success with EPW, which are convention planners who come to San Antonio and look and see what we have to offer and book major conventions here.

We could have an Democratic National Convention here or Republican National Convention here, but we need to be able to have the hotel space to be able to do that.

So as the city continues to grow and obviously population growth in Texas and not just San Antonio is off the charts.

But yeah, I see it as needed.

If you mention even the possibility of rebuilding the Alamodome, I don't know.

That's the first time I've heard it mentioned.

It literally is right there.

Along with Project Marble, some people are going to see dollar signs and say, oh my gosh, they're going to want so much money from me.

But that's something we're talking about way down the road.

That's not at the top of the list of what's going on.

Right?

So when they talk about Project Marble, I mean, the first piece of it is really getting the Spurs arena.

And in downtown, the Alamodome is probably 7 to 10 years, probably in the future.

And when we look at, and because obviously renovations have been made to the Alamodome, I was there for the Alamo Bowl.

Not a great game, but still had a lot of fun, obviously.

But anyway, let's get from a practical standpoint.

First things first.

The Spurs have always wanted to be back in downtown.

We remember the days of the HemisFair arena.

You and I had San Antonio a very long time.

I'm a native San Antonio and so I would love to see the Spurs back downtown.

But to your point, we have to figure out what we're doing to take care of the car and the Coliseum, the rodeo, and really what is now the Frost Center and what's going to happen there.

Another thing you're looking at is parking.

And Centro San Antonio is involved in a parking study because that's one of those things that people who live here say, I'm not going down.

And unless I can figure out a place to park and there isn't really that's in our minds.

Sometimes I think people downtown or work downtown live in the city hall, think, well, there's plenty of spaces and they're not on the same page.

What do you tell people about parking?

What are you finding out?

Yeah.

So let me just tell you, it's one of the number one complaints I have regarding downtown is not just accessibility to parking, but also affordability.

I mean, it's expensive to park in downtown, which is why micromobility is a little runner and project that we established with UTSA becomes very important.

So people only have to park one time and then they can be moved throughout downtown.

But the parking study will look at accessibility, how many parking spaces that we have.

Then we'll figure out the affordability equation associated with it.

But I would like to get to a point when we see the outcomes associated with the parking study, that if you're in Stone Oak or you're in Birney, or you're in the Dominion or you're in, you know, Alamo Ranch, that you can reserve a parking space for one that's available because it decreases the intimidation associated with coming into downtown.

Oh, I got my parking space.

I know exactly where I'm going.

I mean, that's part and parcel regarding making downtown friendlier, like I said, and less intimidating because it can be difficult to navigate downtown.

I say all the time, you'll appreciate this, that whoever laid out the ground in downtown must have been drunk.

Wow.

Well, I think it was confusing.

You.

Yes, yes, part of it.

Those cattle roads ain't.

Exactly.

Right.

As well as Canary Islanders.

I'm not sure if they were drunk.

Well, anyway, thank you very much.

Tricia Berry, CEO and president, Central San Antonio, great to talk with you, as always.

And I'm sure we'll have a lot more to talk about when you get.

To come back and talk about safety and security, because that's always top of mind with us.

Yes.

Thank you very much.

Yeah, absolutely.

A research project involving people right here at Texas A&M University, San Antonio is focusing on, of all places, the Yucatan, Mexico and underwater caves.

They're here to tell us all about this fascinating project is Elizabeth Borda, associate professor of natural sciences at Texas A&M San Antonio.

Thank you very much for coming in.

This is probably the last project I would have expected that, Texas A&M, San Antonio and San Antonio South Side would get involved in with underwater caves in Mexico.

How did this happen?

So I've been doing quite a bit of work with regards to the genetics of some of the cave organisms.

From that region.

And then when I arrived to, Texas A&M San Antonio, there was an opportunity to collaborate with researchers at Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution.

And so we submitted a project to now, instead of focusing on the organisms that live in the water column, which most of the research has focus on, to focus on the organisms that live in the sediment.

So at the bottom of these caves.

So we absolutely know very little about what lives there.

And so we're talking about animals that are less than one millimeter in size 2.45 micron.

So really, really tiny from multicellular organisms to single celled organisms is what lives in these sediments.

So how are you researching this?

What are you doing?

And you've been doing it for a couple of years and continuing to do it.

Next month.

You're going down there?

Yes.

Yeah.

So, so we have a team of cave divers, and so we sample at different sections within these systems.

So there's typically the entrance where you're going to see lots of light as you move and you move into a cavern zone where you still see light, but it's not direct.

And then you move into the dark cave section, dark cave, regions of, you know, where there's no light at all.

And so we're looking at what are the differences across these various sections in terms of who, who lives there.

And so the divers will go in and they will take the first few centimeters of sediment.

And we will sample that and then we will after their, their sample.

Then I will photograph them and video whatever critters are moving, they're not very easy to see sometimes, especially when we're dealing with these tiny critters.

They're not everywhere.

You're not, you know, you don't see them moving.

All you're doing is scooping sediment.

And so a lot of times we will leave them, overnight, and then eventually we'll see little tracks of little, snails and little crustaceans that have emerged.

And then that's when we can, you know, be opportunistic and and take photographs and videos.

But then a lot of our work is really in the genetics, which is done in San Antonio.

And now if people have been down there as a tourist, say this is their teacher needs to loom and apply, they'll come in that area.

Yes.

And we as tourists, you can go into this and notice, is that the same place that you're going?

And much farther down or.

Or further in?

So most, tourists will essentially be in the, in the snow day where it's just the, the the pool, the sinkhole, where you have just the pool of water where folks can go swimming, but the divers go much deeper into the system so many times.

Again, it just looks like a nice little pool of water.

But there are, passages underground.

And then that's where our divers will go.

And underground also, this is close enough to the ocean that there is some saltwater.

The marine, environment, but also some freshwater.

Yes.

And so you're looking at both or the combination there.

So for the, for that, well, right now we're only focusing.

Well, actually it's really complicated because it depends on which how close you are to the coast.

Further out it might take you might the reaching the saltwater layer might be much deeper.

As you get closer to the coastline, it's going to be much shallower.

So you as soon as you go in, you might already reach the saltwater layer.

So we do have another site in Cozumel Island that has a direct connection to the ocean.

So you have a Marina and then there's a connection to that.

So notice so when you go in the water is already slightly brackish.

But then you reach the saltwater layer pretty quickly.

Whereas in caves on the Yucatan for example, in some areas it will take, you know, quite a bit of, diving to reach the Salt Lake.

And you published some of your findings so far, but obviously you're going to go, back next month.

What what are you finding?

What are you expecting to find when you analyze all the data?

So we're looking to see, well, not only who lives there, but because we've been sampling every six months.

We're also looking at trends with related related to, meteorological events.

So hurricanes, because hurricanes, heavy rainfall, drought, all of those things are going to potentially cause some changes underground.

But we don't know.

So, my postdoc, Fernando Calderon, he published the study in Cosmo Island where after a short, four day of heavy rainfall, the the water, essentially the layer that sits above the marine water layer was displaced.

So normally when you go into this particular cave, it's on Cosmo Island.

You are in the brackish water layer, and then you have animals that live in the marine water layer.

And there you see a lot of marine life.

So sea stars, things, things that you would see in the ocean inhabit sections of this cave.

But after that heavy rainfall, the the top layer was displaced.

And so essentially those animals that are are sitting in the marine water are now in brackish water.

So that's a huge salinity shock for those organisms.

So he so he was able to document how that change impacted temporarily those species, but also the species that are adapted to the case.

So further in they were less, impacted by that event because they're already deep within the cave.

So, so.

When your students here in San Antonio find out that you're doing this kind of research, first of all, that they say, hey, do you have a place for me on the plane?

I want to go down and help out.

And what does it mean to them and to San Antonio that you're able to do this kind of research?

Well, actually, one of my master's students, Gabby von her.

And, so she became a master's student, and I gave her this project focus focusing on the population genetics of shrimp and she, as she was sharing her research with her mother, her mother said, you know, your aunt has a property in the Yucatan.

And and so we asked her more about that.

And this led to an expedition.

We brought a team to her aunt's properties, or aunt lives on a doesn't live there, but she has a house where there's a giant sinkhole in her backyard.

So the house is on undisturbed, jungle.

So it's about, I think, 250 acres.

So it's a pretty large plot of land.

So there's very little urbanization around it.

There is a small little town.

So to to, maybe, like, you know, five miles away from the house, and that sinkhole had never been studied before.

And so, we organized a team, including that student, and we went there and we stayed there and, the the the sinkhole was mapped, and then we collected organisms.

We collected water to look at bacteria, the microbial community and whatever critters we we could find.

And so it turns out that that sinkhole was 200ft deep and is just sitting in someone's backyard.

And and lastly, here is this kind of, a wake up call for some people here in San Antonio to realize that you're doing a lot more in a, at a university in San Antonio than we might think.

We might stereotype.

Well, you'd be doing some desert research on the south side of San Antonio, and that's pretty much it.

But that's not at all.

No, but I mean, it's because we had the opportunity because we had we were granted this, this grant in order for us to, to go there.

And if there's one more seat on a plane for us.

So let me know.

But, I it a fascinating, research project.

Elizabeth Borda, associate professor of natural sciences at Texas A&M University, San Antonio, thanks very much.

Thank you.

On our reporters roundtable this week, we are talking everything over real estate, from vacancies to rents.

And joining us to tell us all about it is Madison Esler, who is business reporter for the San Antonio Express-News.

Thank you very much for coming in.

Now, you recently looked at all of this and this kind of a mixed bag in terms of where we are in terms of how many apartments were built.

So just last year and then how that's affecting rents.

There are a whole lot more built than people might have expected last year.

Just last year, just last year, yes.

Developers built a lot of apartments in San Antonio.

Coming out of the pandemic, financing terms were better than they are now.

San Antonio grew a lot during the pandemic.

It was growing before, but a lot of folks moved here.

And so those apartments are just now being finished, apartments that were started a couple of years ago.

And that's put kind of a damper on rents because there's so much supply to be absorbed.

That's somewhat of a good thing for tenants.

Maybe you can get a month free or two months free, or your application fee is waived because the owners of these buildings are really trying to lease up.

Have the rents stabilize, flatten, actually gone down, or are they just, they're definitely not free fall.

Yeah.

Overall rents in the area have gone down the past two years.

It's been a while since the last time rents went down, so that's noteworthy.

Economists expect rents to start going up in the next couple of years as the supply is absorbed.

But it's nothing like what we saw during the pandemic when rents went up quite a bit double digits.

That supply being absorbed.

We're talking about 12,000 units or more or just last year, came online.

So what are the what's the forecast now for the next couple of years?

Economists think that the construction is going to start to go down.

That was a huge amount of supply coming onto the market.

It's going to take time for that to get absorbed.

And so developers are kind of pushing the brakes and saying, let's let that get absorbed.

Let's see what happens with rents, and then we'll go back to building more.

So next year, this year, construction will fall from that 12,000 point quite a bit.

So I'm looking to, rent someplace.

What can I ask for these days and expect to get where I. I might not have gotten that before.

Well, a lot of landlords are offering concessions.

So if you're going to a website for an apartment complex or looking on Zillow or something like that, you'll probably see landlords saying, hey, we'll give you a month free will, waive your pet fee, or your application fee will give you these various perks or discounts to try to get you to sign at our complex.

Because once you've signed, you're probably not going to move out.

It's a hassle to move.

It's expensive to move, so they're just trying to get you in.

How about office space and the vacancies for offices?

It is higher in San Antonio than, many places, but not most of the country.

Really?

Yes.

Buildings here are definitely emptier than they were before the pandemic.

More folks are working from home.

More companies have downsized the amount of space that they're leasing.

But because of the industries, the major industries in San Antonio, and also because of just how much office space has been built here, the vacancy rate isn't as high as in other markets.

There aren't a ton of office buildings here compared to what cities like Dallas, Houston, Austin have built.

We just have a smaller market and so it's not as affected.

And some of our major industries like the military, like health care, like hospitality, a lot of those folks can't work from home.

And so that's played into the vacancy rate, too.

What about housing in terms of new houses being built?

Have we slowed that that big push that we had a few years ago, a couple of years ago?

It's still fairly high, but similar to apartment landlords, builders are offering a lot of incentives to try to get buyers.

Those are specifically for new homes, not pre-owned homes, but they're offering to buy down the rates.

They're offering closing costs to cover part of the closing costs to make it more attractive for buyers to to purchase their houses because interest rates are still fairly high.

Or is there a, a big difference between some of the higher profile, projects that we see, say, around the Pearl area and apartments there and condos in that area compared to the rest of San Antonio, and not just in terms of the price, but in terms of the optimism of the builders.

Or is that just a focus that we we focus on those stories more?

I think there's a lot of optimism around the Pearl.

People really want to be there and so that's definitely affecting what's built in the area.

Oxbow development Group, which developed the Pearl, is basically doubling the size of the Pearl across the river and around the brewery.

And so they're clearly confident that there's a lot of demand for apartments.

They're building almost 700 apartments in that area.

So that's a lot of new inventory coming onto the market.

But the apartments they have at Pearl are filled up.

There are waiting lists for some of them.

And so I think that indicates that there's confidence in that area for demand.

And that area.

We used to think of just as the Pearl or maybe that North Broadway.

But now we're seeing stories about the Government Hill and, big Condo, possibly being built in that area.

A little controversial, yes.

The Pearl is kind of set off a wave of development in that area.

Not only is Oxbow doing more projects, but a lot of other developers are coming in and building housing, restaurant shops.

And so this particular proposal, an Austin developer wants to build a 15 story condo building with a little grocery store on the bottom, just kind of east of Broadway.

It's right on the edge of where you've got single family homes, kind of the older Government Hill neighborhood, and then you've got all of these new buildings that have gone up along Broadway, apartment complexes, office buildings.

And so some neighbors want to see it happen.

They're used to the tall buildings in the area going up, and they really want a grocery store.

So that piece is attractive.

But others say, this is really tall for our area.

This would tower over our houses.

It's not in sync with the area.

And so it remains to be seen if the developer will lower the height or if that project will move forward.

And that's still in the earliest phases of that.

So we don't know if it's going to be ten stories, five stories or how long down the road do you think it will be before they decide.

The developer still has to go through the rezoning process?

And so that takes time.

So at this point, they've said we're pressing pause.

We're going to talk to more residents in the area and see if we can change the height, potentially of the building and see if people would be more amenable to that.

So it'll be a while.

How long do you think the, the bubble here at the Pearl, the growth is going to continue.

I mean, for the foreseeable future moves nothing pulling it back right now.

There's still enough people, enough young people, new people willing to to try moving in.

In that one area.

It seems like there is for now.

There's a lot going on.

Developers are confident there are some projects that haven't come out of the ground yet that are planned, like Broadway East, or like the McCombs family's plans next to the Museum of Art.

But that also means there's less land to develop because there are new buildings on it.

So we'll have to see how long the bubble lasts.

And to read all about it.

You can check the San Antonio Express-News and the work of business reporter Madison Hessler.

Thank you very much for coming in Pacific, and thank you for joining us for this edition of On the Record.

You can see the show again.

You can watch any previous shows.

You can also download the podcast.

Just go to klrn.org I'm Randy Beamer and we'll see you next time.

On the record is brought to you by Steve and Adele Dufilho